Imagine this scenario.
You are about to fly to the U.S. Suddenly, over the intercom, you hear the pilot’s voice:
“Ladies and Gentlemen. This is your captain speaking. I’ve had…a leading from God. He told me that I shouldn’t take you to the U.S. Yes, I heard his voice while I was shaving. You know what? We aren’t flying to Los Angeles today. We’re going to Moscow. How about that?”
What would you do? That’s the last time I fly Shekinah Airlines, that’s what I would say!
Over the years, I have slowly seen the dominating influence of the charismatic movement across all denominations and churches. In fact, the rise has been meteoric and wide-ranging. Music is the one such vehicle of this transmission. When I heard “Shout to the Lord” in a conservative Catholic church one Sunday, I knew that it wouldn’t be far long before the Vatican would have it’s own version of the televangelists on TBN (But being Italian, they’d have a lot more style, I presume). In fact, the Catholic Charismatic movement, by some estimates, far exceeds the number of Protestant Charismatics.
In the past, I was content to keep quiet because the raging debates between myself and some of the more vocal charismatics in my own family were so divisive that my grandmother banned all theological discussions at the family dinner table for a while.
Yes, I know, I have a weird family; others fight over money, we fight over Theology.
But now I’m taking a stand because of what I see as an almost patronising and arrogant view by charismatics in general that their view is that dominant, and therefore correct hermeunetical view. This disregards the fact that their movement is only about a hundred years old, and other views have had a longer and more traditional base to claim on. Might, numbers and being the newest doctrine on the block doesn’t always equal righ
Who of us that have maybe questioned the validity of what charismatics believe have been accused with these lines:
“ You are trying to quench the Holy Spirit’s power. That’s a sin!”
“ Sigh. I guess you don’t understand how the Spirit works..”
“ Why are you being an obstacle to God’s work?”
“ I think Satan has clouded your judgement. There’s demonic activity somewhere!”
“ You are only experiencing of what it feels like to be a Christian. If only you could feel what I’m feeling”
and my personal favourite:
“ You think too much. Don’t over analyse. Just let go, and let God!”
What if I told you that there were Christians who thought, felt, saw and tasted God more intently than ever before outside of the charismatic circle?
What if by leaving most of that goofiness behind, the authentic Christianity you would experience would render that a pale shadow?
Far from taking you into a ‘experience’ with God through a secondary baptism in the Holy Spirit ( a Biblically dubious contention), you become wrapped in world where self-worship sometimes becomes the norm, where you lay your God-given rational faculties down for superstition wrapped up in pseudo-Christian gift wrapping and where Gnostic patterns of ‘hidden knowledge’ suffuse it’s practice
I think one reason why people like me haven’t spoken up is that we didn’t want to look as though we were dividing the body of Christ. Maybe some of it was a low self-esteem; it could be that deep down, we thought we were missing out on ‘something’. And we wanted to be part of the good stuff, but really deep down, it didn’t sink right
Keeping quiet was okay until I realised that silence to some meant assent to them. And this was not definitely so.
And when I started seeing people’s life’s get bent out of shape by false prophecies, healings that were supposed to occur but never did; I wanted to address them
Also, and when the people who could one day run the world’s greatest superpower with nuclear weapons at hand could alter the course of my destiny, and my unborn children with policies that are dictated by your ‘leadings’, then you’ve crossed the line
It took me many years to work out why. It meant unloading all the rubbish that I had been fed and seeing again with the eyes of the Spirit. And this time, I understood what living in the Holy Spirit meant. It means that the focus is on Christ – and only him.
I am a Cessationist. This means that I believe that the more spectacular gifts in the early church, like speaking in tongues, ceased upon completion of the Canon (the Bible). I think that God still heals, and will always heal. He is the source of all healing – whether it’s from your white blood cell count stabilising on it’s own or in the form of a flying hospital giving you your precious sight back. He can work miracles outside of the natural laws, although all evidence points to the fact that for this time period; he has chosen to work within them.
I find the practice of ‘being slain’ downright goofy and not backed by scripture. Tongues as spoken today seems to be more of an auto-suggestive practice and until I find a healing incident involving the resuscitation of the dead and regeneration of a severed limb backed by the British Medical Association or some reputable scientific body; I remain sceptical
Wednesday, October 8, 2008
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14 comments:
nice one. very true indeed. a lot of people today depend on feelings and emotions but abandon rational thought. in my opinion, emotions should complement rational thought, not kill it. Someone said once, "Christ came to take away sins not take away our brains." :P
Yes, speaking in tongues have been overhyped. The Bible says that when one speaks publicly in tongues, someone must interpret. We see a lot of tongues but no interpreter. I believe people can still speak in tongues today but God will give an interpration also. God is not an author of confusion. Without interpration, the tongue is questionable.
It's better to speak in a language which everyone know.
I felt like I was in a madhouse when I first attended a charismatic church and the congregation started to speak in tongue.
walking disaster, this is exactly what happened to a non-christian colleague of mine. she walked into a charo church and she thought that they were all a little weird, to say the least
Ian, let me put a question to you. If tongues are still valid today and according to the Bible, they need an interpreter; but have you ever seen an interpretation to date?
If not, then I want to contend that logically and evidentially, the practice of tongues as seen in present day churches is not the tongues seen in the early NT church
It's like saying that supposed miracles today are different from the OT. Whoa! You mean we have lesser miracles? Think about it..
"God I pray that you will forgive us for not believing in your miraculous ways and for putting You in a box, as well as questioning your power"....*Chris storms out of the prayer meeting*
Oh G, we forgot to mention the oil-secretion and gold dust!
Just attended City Harvest's Dance My Love or something like that.
Throughout the entire thing, I was thinking. Whether the word 'Church' meant... the Christian kind of church or the other type of church. You know... the S word... 5 letters... and when they were speaking in tongues, I kinda had this feeling that the S guy was sitting somewhere in the corner laughing his ass off at these people.
I can't believe the pastor said it's ok for girls to be scantily dressed!
And he's no older than Hans. I think... he has blonde hair... and he's married with a kid
really?? what was his reason?
He didn't have a reason.
Cause he was like talking to the non Christians.
He was saying, "When you first step into this church, you might have noticed that our music is loud, the girls clothings are abit exposing. But it's all ok..." I was like... how is he gonna evangelist unbelievers?
seeker friendly, seeker friendly..its the way to go for those guys i guess...just get the numbers in...don't care if they are truly saved or not...
bjj...exactly. therefore, those speaking in tongues publicly without an interpreter is doubtful. i believe that God can still give valid tongue and interpreter today if he wanted to. the Holy Spirit can still give that gift to people if he wanted to.
i guess overtime people misused the gift and turn it into something that will make them seem super-spiritual. people will like "whoah...whats this? mysterious...this guy must be super-spiritual"
"It's like saying that supposed miracles today are different from the OT. Whoa! You mean we have lesser miracles? Think about it.."
i dun understand...>.<
Chris, I purposely left out the gold dust groupies and the holy laughter loonies because even the AOG has distanced themselves away from this for being to extreme (rolls eyes here)
What's the oil secretion thing about?
Walking disaster, that's an interesting point. As you know, one of the Devil's main tools for evil is sowing confusion and delusion. If more people walk out of a service totally blur at what happened or so 'emotionally high' that they forgot what the service was all about..i.e: God, then I agree that the Enemmy is laughing his horned head off.
Ian, there are some who say that the miracles today cannot be on the same level as the really canggih ones in the OT (i.e:parting of the Red Sea). So, we should be happy settling for some guy in a bad haircut and cheap suit casting out the demon of a headache in some auditorium.
I disagree.
My belief is that given God's incredible providence, his miracles these days are even more spectacular; just worked through other means.
In the gospels, Jesus healed one blind man. Today, eye surgeons heal thousands every day around the world. A flying eye hospital, ORBIS, takes eye surgeons to all 4 corners operating and giving sight to kids and adults in Africa who have been blind since birth.
So, has the age of miracles ceased? It depends on your definition - you've heard mine now :-)
well basically, along with the gold dust came the leaking oil from people's palms and stuff...oil anoiting...youtube (whereelse) has some interesting videos of this...
Uh..i think that's somewhere up there with Bigfoot and the X-Files to be honest
Again, in a world wracked with poverty and strife; why can't these guys manifest a couple of cheques to World Vision or some Blood (pref type O+). What oil came out? I hope it was good Italian extra-virgin olive :-)
its fragrant oil...some say Chanel No.5...others, Ralph Lauren Blue...but there are those which believe it to be the lost blend of the House of Creed...
At the price oil is these days, i rather secrete some Brent Crude and sell it...
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